Forums The Vibe Chat police monitoring of party message boards

Viewing 25 posts - 1 through 25 (of 32 total)
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  • #1040456
    Avatarmonkeyboy2004
    Participant

    what with the constant cries of OB on squatjuice does anyone know if there has ever actually been a proven case of a police officer, or any other anti-rave type, coming here or any other party forum, and pretending to be a raver?

    i personally wouldn’t be surprised if some had but i doubt they’d get much info.

    also since these boards ae monitered by the police, does anyone know how much? is it a constant ongoing process or does someone just pop in and have a look about now and then.

    #1099485
    Avatargloballoon
    Participant

    AFAIK police regulations would prevent police from registering and pretending to be someone else

    when people say ‘OB’ what they mean is the info being asked for is bait

    and yes, monitoring is regular

    #1099494
    AvatarMeltown
    Participant

    If you were in the police and it was your job to stop raves (ie The TVP anti rave squad) squatjucie would be the most useful resourse for constantly updating information, of who was doin parties, where parties where happening, what rugs are most popular, if theres much voilence

    its all written there, which is why people are very untrusting of new members or anyone lookin for partylines,

    if i was ob an i wante dto find out about raves, id go undercover on sj

    #1099474
    AvatarGeneral Lighting
    Moderator

    yes, all message boards with a large number of young people on them are now monitored by cops, that goes for myspace and bebo as well as all the rave boards.

    most antis don’t pose as ravers – its neither that easy or effective. Cops can find raves just by monitoring traffic movement patterns on CCTV in “likely” areas.

    Antis tend to just lurk around and see what stuff they can find to use against the rave scene (such as examples of drug addiction or criminality associated with drug use, racist sentiments, or people just bragging about fighting/crime)

    #1099492
    AvatarSound-Guy
    Participant

    I think its a case of reading what has been wrote about partys and even legal events so they can try and prepare for the futre. Well known that C.I.D are monitering a venue where there are small legal events in my home town at the mo. Its not hard for them to pose as a raver and ask for a partyline number, thats why peeps try to keep things from new commers.

    This scene needs to be kept on the Downlow for the sakes of us all!

    #1099475
    AvatarGeneral Lighting
    Moderator
    Sound-Guy wrote:
    I think its a case of reading what has been wrote about partys and even legal events so they can try and prepare for the futre. Well known that C.I.D are monitering a venue where there are small legal events in my home town at the mo.

    Thames Valley have always monitored every legal dance music event in their area as they consider them to be focal-points for drug-related crime. Each crew who puts on an event is scrutinised for their links with free party crews, drug dealers etc…

    They were doing this about 7 or 8 years ago when I lived in Reading …

    #1099493
    AvatarSHNYDE
    Participant
    monkeyboy2004 wrote:
    what with the constant cries of OB on squatjuice does anyone know if there has ever actually been a proven case of a police officer, or any other anti-rave type, coming here or any other party forum, and pretending to be a raver?

    i personally wouldn’t be surprised if some had but i doubt they’d get much info.

    also since these boards ae monitered by the police, does anyone know how much? is it a constant ongoing process or does someone just pop in and have a look about now and then.

    O.B. :groucho:

    #1099487
    AvatarquietRIOT
    Participant

    This is a posibility…cops come on an pretend to be clubbers to get info on parties ….im always dubious about giving info out about parties…. on the net i wouldnt ….:group_hug

    #1099491
    AvatarCT23
    Participant
    monkeyboy2004 wrote:
    what with the constant cries of OB on squatjuice does anyone know if there has ever actually been a proven case of a police officer, or any other anti-rave type, coming here or any other party forum, and pretending to be a raver?

    i personally wouldn’t be surprised if some had but i doubt they’d get much info.

    also since these boards ae monitered by the police, does anyone know how much? is it a constant ongoing process or does someone just pop in and have a look about now and then.

    OB raaa

    #1099483
    Avatarbinge
    Participant

    Haven’t you ever played ‘spot the undercover pig’ at parties. Great fun.

    (Although until I grew my hair I was often accused of being OB!)

    Telltale signs are often: Bottles of lucazade, and excessively over the top spitting on the floor (to mimic k-heads I suppose)!

    #1099476
    AvatarGeneral Lighting
    Moderator
    binge wrote:
    Haven’t you ever played ‘spot the undercover pig’ at parties. Great fun.

    (Although until I grew my hair I was often accused of being OB!)

    Telltale signs are often: Bottles of lucazade, and excessively over the top spitting on the floor (to mimic k-heads I suppose)!

    the spitting is a new one (presumably since K became more popular) – but the ones we got in Thames Valley often dressed like what ravers might have looked like in 1989 (presumably when the training manuals were last updated)

    mind you nowadays there’s probably enough 30-something cops who used to be ravers but either gave up, burned out or had a negative experience so crossed the blue line (people my friends know have quit raving and joined the old bill), so its stupid to assume cops don’t have good knowledge about how the rave scene works

    I don’t think they try that many proper deep cover ops, as when the Met did this in the 1990s they lost loads of young officers who thought that raving and drugs was way more fun than following rules and ended up having to be sectioned/invalided out of the force…

    jokes, until you realise it costs the public purse about 50 grand per cop which goes out that way (IMO they should have sued them for the cost of their training and salary)

    oh yeah, and as Asians aren’t that common at raves I used to be accused of being a cop as peopel thought “they always send the “streetwise ethnic minority” officers on this sort of job…”

    #1099498
    AvatarDisco Tim
    Participant

    And lets not forget about one sound system that hasnt been seen out and about for a while because its owner was given an asbo thanks purely to photographic evidence from sj! (Hence no gallery anymore.)

    #1099486
    AvatarPaulM
    Participant
    Disco Tim wrote:
    And lets not forget about one sound system that hasnt been seen out and about for a while because its owner was given an asbo thanks purely to photographic evidence from sj! (Hence no gallery anymore.)

    That s MAD how ever was it enough Evidence. :hopeless:
    Poor Chap!

    #1099488
    Avatarraverbaby
    Participant

    makes you wonder if you metioned a false party on here what would acutally happen.

    #1099477
    AvatarGeneral Lighting
    Moderator
    PaulM wrote:
    That s MAD how ever was it enough Evidence. :hopeless:
    Poor Chap!

    it was used with other evidence such as the cops’ own photos and statements from locals.

    people were very careless and were using SJ gallery as a place to dump entire camera chips rather than selectively editing the pics

    many pics uploaded shots of rig vans and rig people with registration marks, from landmarks in the background its reasonable proof

    each gallery showed who it was uploaded by, its simple enough for the cops to also monitor the messageboard and work out from the threads who associates with who. And when arguments happen people tend to stick up for their friends and local rigs – loads of info leaks out that way.

    also most rigs have distinctive speakers and sometimes banners that identify who they are, people would put comments like “DJ **** playing his set”

    matched up with helicopter footage (which contains GPS position and timecode data), and other info CID have got on people there would be plenty of evidence for Court..

    plus people who take photos didn’t think about metadata. As most of you who own digital cameras know (or should know) your camera stores a bunch of stuff in the jpg file such as the date and time taken, type of camera, shutter and aperture settings… most PCs on broadband sync to atomic clocks over the internet so their time and date is usually fairly accurate..

    if this data isn’t removed thats more proof the picture of a certain place was taken at a certain time…

    #1099502
    AvatarFur Cue
    Participant
    raverbaby wrote:
    makes you wonder if you metioned a false party on here what would acutally happen.

    Do you mean like last summer before the bank holiday everyone in the know built up the crappy essex rave into a ‘Mega Rave’ so the police and media would focus on that, while we all went of to decent events?

    Sadly, all the idiots who still decided to go to the one in Essex and then didn’t leave when told to got hurt by the police and by stupid twats throwing bottles

    #1099478
    AvatarGeneral Lighting
    Moderator

    perhaps a better way to look at this issue is…

    why would the Police not monitor every aspect of a youth movement which over the last 20 years has been heavily associated with drug use and other forms of criminality, and attracts a lot of young teenagers into rebellious and sometimes criminal lifestyles?

    most rave forums are fairly unrepentant about a massive level of illegal drug use and other “naughty activities”…

    I think though rather than get paranoid about “undercover infiltrators” people just need to have a bit of common sense. if cops want partylines they could get them easily from some mailing lists that send them out without any challenge, or even just nicking some random for drugs possession and checking their mobile phone (most people store partylines in their phones against the rig names!)

    Even today cops still don’t always bother with shutting down parties if they are not done constantly in the same areas and don’t piss off loads of locals…

    #1099501
    Avatarskinyourein
    Participant

    :laugh_at:LMAO at this..quality with a capital K. Have you got any links for this i wanna read all about it

    #1099479
    AvatarGeneral Lighting
    Moderator
    skinyou’rein wrote:
    :laugh_at:LMAO at this..quality with a capital K. Have you got any links for this i wanna read all about it

    unfortunately it all happened around 1995/6 before the newspapers went online and was mostly reported in the Daily Mail which don’t keep good archives online anyway….

    it was after Leah Betts died, the Eastern constabularies and the met went on this big mission and tried to crush the rave scene and infiltrate all the rave clubs.. ironically thats why there are or were so many illegal raves in East Anglia as many legal venues got closed..

    the funniest one was the police dealing ring that was going on in the Ministry of Sound, that only fell apart because one cop did so many drugs he ended up freaking out, turned to Christianity and then grassed up everyone else…

    #1099484
    Avatarmonkeyboy2004
    Participant

    since the nature of these boards have changed over the last two years, pv and sj especially.

    where they used to be more of a resource for finding out about parties and have now become pretty much a discusion area about parties.

    i reckon it would be nice, if not productive, to have some input from the police on here. Whether we like it or not they are as much a part of the free party scene as a lot of things, and a think a bit of communication betweeen the two groups would help a lot of problems.

    #1099503
    Avataruiffi
    Participant

    are you talking about real communication?i don’t think it possible, sorry..at least until they will go on using their fucking violence to stop parties and any form of different way of thinking…until they will go on repressing everything not belonging to their “Law”…you can’t find a meeting point (??) with people like that,who only do what someone else impose them to do..what we should do, it’s convincing people that we are not criminals and dealers, so that we won’t be a minority any more and government and any kind of power would be obliged to change their rules..and police too, they couldn’t join (??) themselves with their stupid violence any more..

    #1099480
    AvatarGeneral Lighting
    Moderator

    unfortunately I don’t think that is possible, as Police pretty much worldwide have to accept their local laws whatever their personal views may be

    ravers are still a minority group within most nations, whilst most governments (and by extension the majority of their people) agree that at present recreational drug use should be illegal, and that private property rights (even those relating to abandoned or disused property) are to be respected by “normal” citizens

    Free parties involve breaking both of these laws (as well as various other lesser laws relating to local noise or licensing restrictions) and few law enforcement officers or authorities are prepared to engage in any form of dialogue with suspected “criminals”.

    It would be seen by many (particularly those with conservative, traditional views who have power within society) as a mockery of the traditional social systems if they did so.

    The only time the cops have posted here “in uniform” so to speak was about 5 years ago (back in the time when you could get away with even posting regions where parties might happen on here) when they warned a crew in SW England that they were monitoring this board and would stop their event (which they did).

    #1099504
    Avataruiffi
    Participant

    …probably I’m describing a world of fantasy,in which prohibitionism doesn’t exist, as well as private property…perhaps, one day…:hopeless:….

    #1099496
    AvatarAJS
    Participant

    Please be careful when playing ‘Spot the undercover’. I got accused of being OB by a couple of pissed up little pricks at a party in Bristol a while back. They kept on and on and on telling me that I’d been busted and they all knew I was OB. In the end I had to threaten to arrest them for obstructing the course of justice to get them to fuck off. Twats.

    With regards to photos being used as evidence…

    Someone told me that digital pictures are inadmissable as courtroom evidence because they can be so easily altered. That is why speed cameras so often don’t work because they use real film. If they were digital they would be permanenty up and just transmit the pics electronically instead of having to have someone come round and change the film from time to time.

    #1099481
    AvatarGeneral Lighting
    Moderator
    AJS wrote:
    Someone told me that digital pictures are inadmissable as courtroom evidence because they can be so easily altered. That is why speed cameras so often don’t work because they use real film. If they were digital they would be permanenty up and just transmit the pics electronically instead of having to have someone come round and change the film from time to time.

    until recently this was the case – but the Police can take a digital photo with a helicopter flying overhead recording timecoded video and GPS locations with their footage of their evidence gathering team also taking the photos/videos (this is another reason why the photos are taken prominently by uniformed officers often wearing distinctive identification tabards)

    Viewed together this is sufficient proof for Court that everyone was in the same place at the same time…

    the use of ravers’ photos may be more problematic from a legal POV but ASBO proceedings only need the civil level of proof – plus as I mentioned previously modern cameras often store accurate timecode of their pictures; then you get people bragging on message boards about how big the party was, and even admitting to crimes/vandalism there….

    This carelessness/arrogance – backed up with the evidence the cops have got with their own electronic surveillance; and witness statements from locals who complain about raves is plenty enough evidence for most British Courts…

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