at present pills might as well be legal as you can buy loads cheaply and not get in that much serious trouble – the war on drugs was lost 20 years ago, ironically when thatcho opened up the trade routes and sped up Customs procedures (particularly round here on the East Coast)

people are already caning them and burdening the NHS and everyone who is curious can find out about pills already because of sites like this and SJ and Erowid, high school kids can easily get any sort of drug these days… the current drugs laws aren’t a deterrent as most youths these days aren’t as willing to blindly obey the law anyway – same as how they don’t see the problem with attending raves.

Some form of decrminalisation and taxation would at least recover a few quid for the NHS which is already picking up the pieces anyway (about 90% of my family work in healthcare and some of them deal with treating mental health problems/drug addiction) rather than a 100% criminal market.

Yes there will be people trying to buck the system with any dutied goods and If people are making fakes then thats the job of the authorities (who won’t be chasing after as many small timers) to catch them and arrest them (same as faking any other product) – plus not everyone is so cheap as to buy fakes. For instance with alcohol I’d rather buy a decent bottle of Scotch than some fake stuff what turned out to be industrial spirit from Latvia…

tobacco is bad and excessive alcohol use is bad but there are many moderate drinkers, and there are plenty of people who take recreational drugs or have done so for years and not fucked up all of their lives.

are you arguing for more control, prohibition and restriction on the whole of British society from the Government merely because a minority cannot or will not self-regulate their lifestyles? Should the more stupid dictate how everyone else has to lead their lives?

People cannot and some will not self regulate there lifestyles in more ways than drugs hence why the govermerment impose laws but those who can seek to do things the more closit way. Bringing in pills legally would introduce all sorts of complications and they are abused period. People like yourself more than likely are strong headed, strong willed and can give and take according to your limits and capabiltys of a substance user which is why i think you find it hard to comprehend how some other peoplearnt like that and need to be protected from something which is far from natural and something which has and can potentionally change peoples lives and mindset

People who cannot cope maybee through down times ect ect would use it to self medicate them selves in the same way a beer would

You on the other hand knows better but alot dont which what makes us individuals.

In all for it to be kept illegal would be one less worry for the goverment other than the huge implications it would cause to make it legal

Same goes for any other drug from a-c

I don’t think full “legalisation” would work until the whole UN agreed on some plan but I think sensible legislation would be that something like you could do a certain amount without penalty provided you did not commit any crime or anti-social behaviour or make yourself unable to contribute to society..

the sort of laws I would like to see would be that if someone does 5 pills on a weekend and goes to work or college on monday that would be OK – but if they drove like an idiot under the influence or got in a fight on the comedown they would get nicked for drugs like the old penalties…

dealers would be subject to quality control and taxation to fund the health service, and if they were involved in violence over turf it should be double the old penalty both for drug dealing and violent crime…

no i wouldnt go as far as that imo and its leaving it totally open to the same situtation now

If say pill became legalised and taxed they would be taxed to fuck Not like it would ever happen but if it did.

People underground would still be in market to sell pills what would be cheaper but neither the less no better quality wise than what they are now

So instead of the tescos outpricing the corner shop

The criminals/ dealers will be outpricing the goverment

Same situ as cheap baccky what quite often can xcome across as fake, But the nature of pills it would be alot more prolific

Then statisitcally pill deaths are few and far between but so are deaths from smoking if the same number of people doing pills every weekend or what everr had a fag instead.

Like 2 fags at a weekend on and off till they decide its pointess and grow out of it, Same with booze. But fags are addictive and booze can ruin people

Pills .. If pills was to become legal everyone would wonder whaty they are and say pill usuage would multipy into millions. That would be mroe than a few extra people dying of reactions/ dehidration, overdrinking, and a lot more people going mental coz they mucnh pills ( coz theer legal innit they cant be bad! attitude) and suffring from the implications of what we all know when it involves the mandy

Trouble is , Us a humans cant deal with holding down things, If it was legal it would be abused to much like booze is,

And come on us brits are renowned fro our drinking habits, Fighting and being wankers so what would we tuern into if pills wheer made legal?

i wiouldnt want to know and i wouldnt have it happen

Doesnt matter what advice you give people,. SOme people wont listen the same people who dont listen to fag packet warnings the same people who dont mind drinking themselves into a stuoper every day the same people who would turn up to our already overloaded hospitals with seratonin disorders and depressive illnesses

We are not all desgined to take these and not suffer so the easiest thing to do as far as the goeverment are concered whether they are particularly low risk as far as there sats are concerned is to keep them illegal

thats what I was pointing out – at present, the more people stick their neck out without addressing the wider issues (drug addiction, noise, trouble etc) they will just provoke a backlash. When Advance party (IMO the last effective campaign) was around they overlooked the problems with the smashy smashy crew which were already happening back then, plus all the squatters getting on to K or heroin.

This why I suggested the only thing worth doing on the party scene is well run parties – they are actually possible even today for those who aren’t dumbed down and disorganised

IMO the only political movements worth supporting are those campaigns which lobby for more sensible drug laws – a combination of proper education as well as controls/enforcement so people learn their limits instead of having to have them enforced all the time by the cops…

yer it would and can be done and i would like to see better info and education on drugs limits, Although i wouldnt legailse any of them

is it really another “political movement” people need? or just better organised party crews?

There was the Freedom To Party movement in 1989 (the Young Tories!!!) with yuppies fighting for legal events on a commercial free enterprise basis (it was the 80s still)

Then Altern 8 (the old skool lot who wore dust masks) set up a political party in 1992 (which was seen as amusing but achieved little else),

Spiral tribe tried the political stuff and as an offshoot from them in 1994 there was the Advance Party movement which protested against the CJA but fractured due to internal politics (although it did contribute to the London free party scene for a bit)

plus its difficult to argue the case for conventional underground parties when they already have been proven by bitter experience to get out of hand..

Maybe all thats needed is a few more events like what Planet Yes did – well organised, held using the TENS system, only cost a fiver to get in (and me and my mates got in there for free, even if one of them did fall in a river on the way) – OK it means effort, discipline and organisation compared to a current free party but is it really that much of a climbdown?

true but as a observation of your post , Non have made it , If not for any remeberable amount of time, And things have only got worse since the 80,s early 90,s. In fact a point could be made that each interventino from us by these means has down nothin more than provoke it to get worse legally

would it help if security was brought back into parties

true dave but then its becoming something different in some peoples eyes, AnD now its not a case of gettin a few hench men who can row to chuck out the odd fighting chav at a party full of hippys, Its a complete chav fest with the enemy withing relishing every punch at the police

There we have a problem

A clued up party / rig / bods would try and get there point across get out and go

Even if the police are wankers , Not sit and fight some ; war

7-10 years ago all these types just didn’t set foot in a rave or if they did people made sure that they behaved themselves or they got sent on their way if they still wanted to behave like a fucking idiot.

somewhere on here is actually a post from 2003 about an EA rave may even have been BK!- where there wasn’t any riot and the cops are mentioning how happy and good natured everyone was.

I wasn’t living in anywhere near EA at this time but others on this board were – in the city that was then my manor (Reading, SE England) our parties were just about OK but just starting to have problems with “townie” culture creeping in, but even then they were OK until about 2005 or so.

In 2006 I moved here and have been to a fair few outdoor parties. I notice two kinds of people – some really sound ravers with the original idea about partying (like all the people I’ve met from here and also Ipswich and Stowmarket crew) –

but I’ve also noticed a lot of lads who think raves are a place to flex and front like they think they are some “ghetto youtdem”. But not all of them fit into the “chav” stereotype either..

easy to blame “outsiders” but too many people are attending raves now looking for a fight – if not with the feds even with each other or other ravers.

I’ve seen beef at EA raves and its between so-called ravers and there hasn’t been a fucking cop in sight never mind riot squad.. Until these scum start being “robustly discouraged” from attending further events then things will get worse, and the East is just making the same stupid mistakes other regions have already done.

yerp to be fair i used to loves raves, No i just dont go anymore

The attitudes from the majority have changed, Ive had shit run ins witht he police, Ive raised a voice of opinion, Been hit < been busted hard but i took it as a knock on the nose and left it like that which is often the best thing to do , MOst people now dont realise that although there freedoms have been infirdged somewhat a rave is still the illegal cat and mouse game it always has been. mAking out riots in the name of raving freedoms and carrying on like a thug is no different in my eyes than the wankers you get in town

Not for me