BNP on Question time BBC1

[Tank Girl]

Was just drinking me hot milk ready for sleepy time


but watching tv as BNP on questiontime - interesting

[1984]

He isn't exactly very good at political debate is he old Griffin, and he went to Cambridge!

[DJCliffy]

That Nick Griffin is getting a battering, i almost feel sorry for him, I wouldn't like a room full of people shouting at me!!

I don't like the way Jack Straw is acting though like his shit doesn't stink. Expenses anyone,

[1984]

I just wish they had put him on news night with the Paxman

[Tank Girl]

it makes cracking tv though

dear oh dear - saying 'the colour is erelevant...... ???'

what the fuck - hasnt he read his own poilicies or are they changing them now to look more PC than the 80's NF?



cunt

[Tank Girl]

Video: BNP's Nick Griffin on BBC Question Time - Telegraph

Watch Nick Griffin, leader of the British National Party, appear on BBC political programme Question Time alongside Justice Secretary Jack Straw, the Conservative shadow minister for community cohesion Baroness Warsi, Liberal Democrat spokesman on home affairs Chris Huhne and playwright and cultural commentator Bonnie Greer.


Three people were arrested as anti-fascist protesters clashed with police at BBC Television Centre ahead of BNP leader Nick Griffin's appearance on Question Time. About 30 activists broke through police lines and made it into the building ahead of the far-right politician's arrival.

[DJCliffy]

I'm glad that Nick Griffin appeared on the show. At least it shows the British public what he and his party are all about and i can say i won't ever vote for them.

Thank god those UAF morons didn't stop the show from happening though, It very nearly didn't happen when they stormed the building.

[Tank Girl]

freedom of speach is freedom of speach - I dont have to agree with what I am hearing but people have freedom to express themselves - and this freedom has been fought for and needs to be retained

It was interesting viewing, and I'm glad they were allowed on - but I dont agree with their party or policies at all



http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/news...Klux-Klan.html

[General Lighting]

Originally posted by DJCliffy

Thank god those UAF morons didn't stop the show from happening though, It very nearly didn't happen when they stormed the building.

nah, a few protestors aren't gonna make any difference - I used to do work for the BBC and they are very security aware and have their own security teams plus liasion with metpol and other government agencies.

over the years they have had to deal with a lot worse including several bombs (when the IRA were more active), and loads of their staff (even light entertainment performers!) get everything from hate mail (including packages containing harmful chemicals and IEDs) to actual attempts to stalk and attack them.

in the 80s there was an actual invasion into the news studio (some lesbians got on the main news!), its kicked off at a few debate programmes before as well and and in recent times their news crews have been constantly coming under attack when filming in dodgy areas.

All controversial debate shows made at BBC have risk assesments and contingency plans for every possible thing what could go wrong - but the priority is to get the news out or keep the show going, using the Police to keep/restore order if and when needed. For a perceived "woolly liberal" public broadcaster, Auntie is a lot tougher than many folks realise.

[globalloon]

poor old nick griffen, he get's really bad press... but really he's like the rest of us... he thinks "adolf went a bit too far"

what a fucking idiot

[Buzz]

Originally posted by globalloon

poor old nick griffen, he get's really bad press... but really he's like the rest of us... he thinks "adolf went a bit too far"

what a fucking idiot

please god dont say he actually said on that QT......

[DJCliffy]

Originally posted by Buzz

please god dont say he actually said on that QT......

No he didn't say that on QT.

[MisterDuck]

i'm undecided about this. certain things annoyed me about the programme.

1. the way migration was discussed as an issue in a manner that completely legitimised the BNP. every party has it's policy on migration, however the bnp were brought into it as though there policy was as plausible as the next. however much i dislike various policies of other parties, their policies were not built on racist, fascist hatred.

2. the way dimbleby told people their questions would be addressed, but they clearly weren't. they were bloody good questions some of them and would of torn griffin apart even more.

3. something about the conservative woman didn't sit right when she was talking about policies on immigration. she sounded as though she was being apologetic for bigotry within communities at times.

4. the very fact the bnp were allowed on the panel. i agree with free speech, however i don't think it was handled well. giving the bnp publicity cannot be a good thing. also question time was the wrong format, newsnight would of been more suited. i personally would refuse to sit on the panel with the man. i can't help thinking that this didn't help the situation at all. i'm not saying deny them free speech, i'm just saying fucking ignore them. they got less votes than last time, they are not a realistic threat - why even bother with them. blank them, not through policy (as that would arguably be against democracy) but just as a common concensus that they are a nothingness. so they have 2 mep seats? that doesnt legitimise them, or particularly make them a realistic threat.

[General Lighting]

I don't think the BBC had much choice in the matter - they made a very good point by hosting this to show the Government it is the job of Ofcom to decide what is acceptable on the broadcast media, not for the BBC to make the judgement.

The BNP are not a particularly fierce threat - what is a threat is the increasing number of angry young men being inspired to join the various "direct action" right wing groups who are prepared to take the fight to the street.

I know of several lads from the rave scene in both SE England and East Anglia who have been successfully groomed by the extreme right - usually it happens when they are becoming disillusioned with drugs and parties, to the point they deliberately try and start racial incidents at certain parties as well as becoming increasingly involved in street violence when drinking.

When Thatcho denied Sinn Fein publicity during the 1980s it resulted in many more IRA bomb attacks (including an escalation of attacks on the British mainland) and could well have prolonged the conflict by a decade.

There's a consensus to ignore a lot of the environmental campaigners on mainstream media, and this is resulting in escalations of their direct action campaigns to the point they are actively trying to damage Britain's power infrastructure and doing nobody any favours.

Unfortunately also all mainstream parties and people (including ethnic minorities already present in this country) are trying to become harder on immigration, because of the recession and this won't change until we have better economic times..

[joshd96320]

BBC would have got slated either way for either allowing it or censoring it. I myself am glad it was aired as it further showed how idiotic, shallow and deceiving he is. since im studying politics i actually had to watch it (i would have otherwise been ensconsed in my room jamming spanish guitar riddims). It was good, his nervous thing with the lips is worse than gordon brown. I hated everything he had to say and his extremely inappropriate laughter, but i feel that he couldnt help the laughter / nerves in places, being in a room hated by everyone. I think that this could potentially ruin his mental welfare, and lead him to go to la la land permanently, but he has himself to blame, he has isolated himself with these stupid views

[General Lighting]

Nick Griffin is now moaning that it was "biased" because it was held in London (because the population is "too multicultural") - but the reason Television Centre was picked is because its layout is easy to lock down in a tense situation whilst still permitting a large studio audience (being familiar to both the BBC Security and the Police)

The use of facilities elsewhere (including even Teddington, LWT or the other similar size studios outside London capable of hosting this such as Granada and whatever that posh new place up at Salford is called) would have created a safety risk to everyone including Nick Griffin as well as all the people what make the telly programme, and they are journalists/creatives/engineers, not coppers or soldiers so its unacceptable to put them at unnatural risk to what they have in their normal job.

when ITV have tried shows like this it has kicked off and innocent people such as studio workers have got injured so I don't blame the BBC for playing safe. Free speech has its price, the British taxpayer has already spent a fair few quid supporting this spectacle..

[DJCliffy]

One thing that bothered me about Question time was that it was more of a witch hunt than an open debate. Instead of actually engaging Nick Griffin about his policies they just hounded him to the point where you actually felt a bit sorry for him. (yes i felt sorry for him as i would any other human being in a room full of hostile people)

Yeah he's BNP but to have a whole studio audience and panel baying for his blood and not letting him speak was a bit unfair, He could of easily been destroyed had they debated like normal adults but tbh they looked like group of bullies and it did them no favours at all.

The presenter was a bit of a twat as well, He ignored quite a few members of the audience who raised valid questions.

Specially the bloke who raised the issue about mass unemployment / immigration, I felt this was worthy of a look given it's an important issue in the UK today but it was ignored.

The show was quite farcical really, typical of the BBC really.

[joshd96320]

good points cliffy

i think also, that its more just the panel trying to put across a point that gains the most applause, but its just hollow. then again thats kinda politics

[General Lighting]

thats the way the BBC operates - if you ever listen to the "brainy" programmes on the BBC Radio 4 like Today you will hear the presenters do exactly the same thing and even to normal politicians or lobbyists including fairly harmless people with positive ideas..

ITV used to be like that but (other than Trevor McDoughnut) they've mostly given up having serious news programmes (even the Anglia news is crap these days and I've not even seen the reasonable documentary/news shows (like "Crimes, Fires and Accidents") they used to have in the 90s..)


todays media thrives on disagreement and controversy rather than trying to make Britain a better place to live in..

[globalloon]

Originally posted by DJCliffy

One thing that bothered me about Question time was that it was more of a witch hunt than an open debate. Instead of actually engaging Nick Griffin about his policies they just hounded him to the point where you actually felt a bit sorry for him. (yes i felt sorry for him as i would any other human being in a room full of hostile people)

do you think the BNP actually have a proper policy on anything? of course people hounded him. he is not a politician, he is a racist maniac who is trying to manipulate the democratic process with the ultimate goal of closing down democracy

Yeah he's BNP but to have a whole studio audience and panel baying for his blood and not letting him speak was a bit unfair

not quite as unfair as denying the right to speak to anyone who has a different skin colour. the whole free speech argument cannot apply to someone who wants to use free to prevent other people from having free speech or access to the democratic process based on the colour of their skin

The presenter was a bit of a twat as well, He ignored quite a few members of the audience who raised valid questions.

david dimbleby is a tv presenting legend that cuts right through people's BS and makes them make a point. watch the programme more often and you will see the high level of skill he employs. what would you prefer he did?

Specially the bloke who raised the issue about mass unemployment / immigration, I felt this was worthy of a look given it's an important issue in the UK today but it was ignored.

it wasn't ignored at all. a significant part of the programme was dedicated to this issue

The show was quite farcical really, typical of the BBC really.

can you name a better mainstream media organisation that has recently allowed a constitutionally illegal, fringe, racist organisation the chance to air their views with the public recently?

[DJCliffy]

Originally posted by globalloon

do you think the BNP actually have a proper policy on anything? of course people hounded him. he is not a politician, he is a racist maniac who is trying to manipulate the democratic process with the ultimate goal of closing down democracy

Well it's backfired on those people on the show now hasn't it. By hounding him the BNP will get more support and a recent poll has said 1 in 5 of the voting public will now back the BNP. Looking on various sites discussing QT quite a few people have said they will now vote BNP.

Knowing the BNP they will capitalise on this and we all have those folks at QT to thank for this.

not quite as unfair as denying the right to speak to anyone who has a different skin colour. the whole free speech argument cannot apply to someone who wants to use free to prevent other people from having free speech or access to the democratic process based on the colour of their skin

Well that's fascism itself isn't it, not allowing someone to speak because you don't agree with their views (albeit racist ones), isn't that what fascism is all about? We are all adults Global, I think i can work out for myself if someone's views are warped. But if you don't let me hear it then i will wonder why this is. It's psychology innit, If i'm not allowed to hear them speak then i will go out of my way to hear them purely because it is a taboo subject.

I'll agree it's in bad taste to let someone with such warped views to speak publicly but hopefully a person with common sense will see it for what it is, utter nonsense and then at least that is one more person who realises what they (extremists) are all about. By silencing them it's all very counter-productive imo and doesn't help show us for what they really are.

david dimbleby is a tv presenting legend that cuts right through people's BS and makes them make a point. watch the programme more often and you will see the high level of skill he employs. what would you prefer he did?

He may well be a legend but on that program he was hardly impartial that night was he? I just saw him as another bully instead of the mediator of the debate.

it wasn't ignored at all. a significant part of the programme was dedicated to this issue

I didn't say all of it was ignored. I said important questions from the audience were ignored and passed by. They might well of discussed it slightly but i wanted to hear more, instead we had the first half which was just a shouting match. Complete waste of time really considering why they were there.

Jack Straw needed to be interrogated a bit more as well i though, I mean it's because of him and Labour why the BNP were there that night.

(Edit) actually looking at what i wrote yesterday you might of thought i said it was all ignored, I meant some questions from the audience, not the subject of immigration, was ignored. Safe.

can you name a better mainstream media organisation that has recently allowed a constitutionally illegal, fringe, racist organisation the chance to air their views with the public recently?

They may well be those things global but the fact is people are voting for them, might not be many but they are and we need to find out why are they voting for groups like the BNP.

Question Time was a perfect opportunity to examine the BNPs policies in an adult manner and it could of shown the public how ludicrous they really are and they could of been destroyed thus showing us why we should not vote for them.

Instead we saw one man being hounded by a room full of people and some people will side with that man. They have made a sort of martyr (not my words heard it on the news from a member of the public) out of Nick Griffin and the BNP will play on that now.

I do not support the BNP as i think they are scum but i think you will see a marked increase in support for them now because of the appalling way QT was held, I truly believe it could of been done a bit better.

I saw the whole thing as a wasted opportunity to show us and expose what the BNP are really all about and why they are not a viable choice but we didn't really see it imo, it was more just attacking one man instead of his party.

You'll probably shoot me down Global but this is just how i see things playing out, I'm not in any way defending the BNP i just think this whole thing will backfire and could be bad for this country in the future.

Although i bet the BBC were pleased with the show, 8 something million viewers wasn't it? Much more than normal ratings.

I hope some of this make sense, I'm a bit hung over this morning and nothing looks right, hence why i keep coming back to adjust stuff lol!

[Soul glow Bro]

the whole thing was a sham..

it was like a celebrity roast (google the term). I laughed out of intentions and shooked my head at some of the audience's recations/questions.

nice one..BBC

[DaftFader]

should of let the pacman on him imo

[MisterDuck]

Originally posted by DJCliffy

I didn't say all of it was ignored. I said important questions from the audience were ignored and passed by.

This wasn't anything special for the Griffin show - this happens week in, week out on any discussion. Dimbleby always omits questions, or says "we'll come back to it later" and never does. It's very annoying, and I would like the programme to be on longer to include more questions, however by no means is it unique to the Griffin episode. Dimbleby would argue it's to "keep focus in the allotted time frame".

A note on Question Time itself:

Question Time was the wrong format because it is one of these "accessible" political programmes. It deals with media-spotlight issues and relies on the panel making "sound-bite" like statements which appeal to the general public. The general public being people that aren't politically in-tune. They are the voters, and need to be appealed to - hence Question Time is one big PR moment for panellists, particularly the Tories (at the moment, but it could equally be Labour in a different political climate) as they can make snide swipes at Labour without ever having to explain their policy in detail.

Compare this to more sophisticated political programmes such as Newnight, which are watched by people who (without wanting to sound snobbish or elitist) know a lot more about politics. Newsnight deals with individual policy and looks in-detail at changes in the law, how they will be implemented, legal issues - it relies on more political intelligence.

Question Time is basically dumbed down politics. It is a show where the general public can air their views and whip up a bit of fury without ever understanding the pragmatical reasons for things, or most of the time, the actual policies that affect [insert latest media target here].

Having said that, there is absolute necessity for programmes like this. Politics needs to be accessible, as politicians need to be accountable. They represent the voters, after all. Closed-door politics understood only by a "political elite" is a threat to democracy.

The issue with the BNP on there is:

1. The media. The decision to allow the BNP on wouldn't have created any uproar if it wasn't for the media. It was a "big thing". Since when has any other Question Time been a "big thing"? It hasn't. This basically played into the hands of the BNP publicity machine.

2. Question Time. It allowed the BNP to debate on a fairly mainstream political programme which thanks to the media was watched by millions, and inevitably created a degree of sympathy a certain percentage of viewers. The BNP had their most successful recruitment night ever, gaining 3,000 more members that evening (Ministers warn of poll boost for BNP after Question Time | Politics | The Guardian).

Wrong format. Do not give an open platform to fascists - by no means impede free speech, but there is a difference between denying legal free speech and openly inviting somebody onto a programme when there is no legal requirement to do so. By legitimising and sharing platforms, European far-right parties in countries such as Denmark and Holland have been able to gain a foothold.

[DJCliffy]