Free party risks in general...

[sheffield-junglist]

Thought I'd start this coz there doesn't seem to be owt like this on the law forum. To be honest I haven't got a clue about the law and free parties apart from the obvious stuff an I'm guessin it would be useful to have this so all the possible things that could happen could be listed here.

Just wantin people to list everythin that can happen legally and how to avoid it.

Thought it would be useful to people who are thinkin of startin to do parties but don't know much about the risks.

So yeh just list what could happen, what that will lead to, what they will do about the sound system(s), tactics the coppers use, what the OB can actually do about it and other stuff like that.

(I know theres already loads about it on this forum but its not all that organised an it would be handy to have it in one place)

[JonnyQuest]

they will take all your shit away.

[spark_plug]

they will take all your shit away.

dont listen to jon. he has a disability which causes him to be a wanker alot of the time

[DJCliffy]

dont listen to jon. he has a disability which causes him to be a wanker alot of the time

Wankers cramp?

[Acidfairy]

This thread may not be such a good idea.

If we collate all the information on what you could potentially be charged with and how to get around it, then we could be seen as trying to help people break the law.

I can see why you'd want to know the kind of things you could be done with but with it all on a public forum that the police do monitor isn't really the best of ideas..

Well IMO anyways

[binge]

Yeah. Good point there. I sometimes feel that way about the Drug section of the forum as well.

Although I do agree it's best to have open and informed discussion on such matters, the powers that be definitely have an opposite view on the matter........

[Southcaver]

If you want to get a good idea just ask some of the rig owners in your area who have been doing it a while,
Theres plenty in sheffield and the give you a better view of how the local coppers go about dealing with partys.

Thought I'd start this coz there doesn't seem to be owt like this on the law forum. To be honest I haven't got a clue about the law and free parties apart from the obvious stuff an I'm guessin it would be useful to have this so all the possible things that could happen could be listed here.

Just wantin people to list everythin that can happen legally and how to avoid it.

Thought it would be useful to people who are thinkin of startin to do parties but don't know much about the risks.

So yeh just list what could happen, what that will lead to, what they will do about the sound system(s), tactics the coppers use, what the OB can actually do about it and other stuff like that.

(I know theres already loads about it on this forum but its not all that organised an it would be handy to have it in one place)

[spark_plug]

as u kno mate ive said ill help u oout when u get up n runnin, n i kno a fair bit, n there will always be people at ur parties who kno how to deal with it! but like acidfairy said, its not the place to be talkin bout it, so when the time comes, it'll get sorted! dont worry about it! its all good!:group_hug

[Digital-A]

Maybe someone give him a hand through pm's or something ... just not in an open thread which guests can view :smile:

[DIONYSUS]

as u kno mate ive said ill help u oout when u get up n runnin, n i kno a fair bit, n there will always be people at ur parties who kno how to deal with it! but like acidfairy said, its not the place to be talkin bout it, so when the time comes, it'll get sorted! dont worry about it! its all good!:group_hug

same as mate, im always up for lending a hand..

[sheffield-junglist]

All of the stuff people have sed here is very true. Might not be such a good idea after all :bad_idea:

Aah well!

Delete this thread or summat or I suppose it doesn't rete make a lot of difference :weee:

Cheers for all the offers of help, will probably take em up when everythins sorted out.

[DIONYSUS]

if you need a dnb dj ; )

[sheffield-junglist]

if you need a dnb dj ; )

Already got one but we'll be needin a lot more:wink:

So far we've got me playin Jungle, ma mate playin DnB and then my other mate playin psy/breaks (Not in the same set lol)
I'm probably gunna do a reggae/dub set as well. Probably not gunna do any dub til the rig is bigger tho. To be honest we'll be wanting as many DJs as possible so when we need em I'll let everyone know!

[DIONYSUS]

then my other mate playin psy/breaks (Not in the same set lol)

there is some quality psybreaks artists out there, check out mood deluxe and far too loud. quality stuff.

[leveret]

If we collate all the information on what you could potentially be charged with and how to get around it, then we could be seen as trying to help people break the law.

Well IMO anyways

The Court of Appeal recently had to remind the CPS that there is no offence of "aiding and abetting" by itself, unless you yourself also commit the same offence you are accused of abetting:
cleared-Derby-shop-cannabis-offences (http://www.thisisderbyshire.co.uk/news/BREAKING-NEWS-cleared-Derby-shop-cannabis-offences/article-196771-detail/article.html)

In other words it's not even illegal to discuss how to do something otherwise illegal and avoid being caught, let alone how to stay safe and on the right side of the law.

In the present climate of unreasoning clampdowns on any party at all, I don't see why it should be a problem to have a thread about how to throw a party safely and without trouble, so as to help someone avoid being charged with illegal acts or having their belongings arbitrarily seized and destroyed.

[General Lighting]

I think what AF and others mean may mean is that if we publically discuss any perceived loopholes in the law they will be closed very quickly due to the level of monitoring and scrutiny a site like this gets.

however, the bulk of the advice here would simply be seen as actually dissuading a young person from committing these "crimes" - much of it explains the full risks (along with verifiable reports from mainstream media or even official Police / Govt sources) of what can happen to those who put on unlicensed music events.

TBH the cops are still cutting people a lot of slack in some regions of the country, but how much is variable at short notice and wholly dependent on the backlash from other members of society and even how many people seek NHS treatment for problematic recreational drug use.

East Anglia went from a party every weekend to lockdown within the space of about a year...

[leveret]

I think what AF and others mean may mean is that if we publically discuss any perceived loopholes in the law they will be closed very quickly due to the level of monitoring and scrutiny a site like this gets.

Yeah I guess that's so ...

however, the bulk of the advice here would simply be seen as actually dissuading a young person from committing these "crimes" - much of it explains the full risks (along with verifiable reports from mainstream media or even official Police / Govt sources) of what can happen to those who put on unlicensed music events.

This is one of PV's great strengths I think, the fact that we have so many people who can give balanced advice like that !

[noname]

Well - thought I'd start the discussion of the original topic off (being as we've cleared up the "is it a good idea to do it here?" question :wink: )

So (this stuff is both from experience and reading around the subject):

1) Having a party isn't illegal in itself until it has been served a section 63 notice (ie you've been told by the OB to stop), and that has been ignored. Basically, if you're told it has to end by a policeman, then that's what you have to do.

It helps here if there is someone on the rig that is willing to deal with the OB when they arrive - one thing that gets right up their noses is getting to a party and being met with lots of blank looks and replies of "huh?" when they ask who the organiser is. This also needs to be someone who is mature enough to realise that the cops on the ground are just doing their job - having someone they feel has the ability to help them do that job will mean they will be much more willing to deal with you as people instead of "evil ravers".... Obviously you may feel that having someone own up to organising is a recipe for prosecution, but see point 2 before you decide to antagonise them this way unnecessarily :wink:.

Try and keep the firebrands in your crew away from them too - having people who want to argue with them around is just going to cause you trouble. Remember that they are just people doing a job, and when they first turn up they will be nervous about the situation they are going into - this is especially true if they have orders to shut you down (put yourself in their shoes, and imagine having to go and tell a group of probably caned people that their party has to stop - takes a fair amount of bravery to go into that not knowing which way it's going to go down.) Argueing and shouting at them is just going to be counter-productive for everyone - they won't be shutting you down unless they have to, and no amount of argueing with them will change that.



2) PEL/TENS legislation - it is now essentially illegal to have an event that is "public" without getting a TENS/PEL. This includes free events, and events for charity.

Used to be a loophole in the legislation that allowed the asking for "donations" to get into a party without a license - these were classed as "private" functions. This changed in the 2003 amendments, and now an event needs a license as long as it is open and advertised to the general public. This has been used recently to prosecute organisers of raves after the event (using video and photographic evidence etc).

This is a bit of a problem, but not something that can't be dealt with by a bit of common sense and a fair amount of patience: Basically, what it does is stop you from advertising any parties you do on public forums in interwebland, handing out flyers, and anything else that comes under the heading of "publicising" the party. What it doesn't do is stop you from having a gathering of a group of friends to listen to some music (if everything is done by word of mouth, the party isn't considered to be "public"). It means you are going to have to slowly get your parties going letting the word filter out from your personal friends, to friends of friends etc - you'll be having very small parties to begin with, but it's surprising how quickly it can build up to being quite big parties....

And as a quick side note to this - charging at free parties is stupid, and generally rude (sending round a donation bucket to cover the costs is cool, but it's a donation, not a fee). If you want to make money from your parties, do it legally and get the license, provide toilets and general facilities, and have an event that isn't going to get shut down....



3) Don't antagonise landowners by wrecking their land, and don't annoy the general public by wrecking public land.

Not strictly speaking laws, but a bit of thought into what you do will go a long way to making life better for everyone...

If you're having a party, make sure the site gets cleaned before you leave - this means having some people go round collecting all the bottles/cans/wrappers etc and binning them properly. It also helps to educate your party people about this stuff - like burying your shite/bog roll if you go to the toilet (unless you plan on having toilets available), and using bins to toss your empties. When it comes to the crunch though, you have to be willing to clean the whole site yourself (you can swear at your punters for being louts after the fact), because you are the people having the party. Saying "it's not my problem because I do X, Y or Z to make the parties happen" doesn't cut it. You're organising the party - you make sure the site is clean after it.... If you're not willing to do this, don't have the parties....

Try and not use private land unless you have permission, and if you do end up doing so, if the landowner comes and asks you to stop, make sure you do. Here it also helps to talk to them like a real person too - you may find that if you explain what you're up to, and that you'll clean the site, and make sure people don't vandalise stuff etc that they are happy to let you carry on - if you live up to your promises, you may find they'll let you have parties there in the future (the forrestry commission are pretty good for this - the land they own is for public use, and it's often the case that visitors are slobs, and the places can get quite a mess. If you turn up, have a party, and the site is clean when you leave they will generally be happy to have you do it. Obviously this entails cleaning up mess that's there when you arrive, but it's a small price to pay for having a regularly usable site...)


That's all I could think of for the now - may come up with more later... Somebody elses go :wink:.

[DIONYSUS]

good advice that.

[sheffield-junglist]

Noname,some sound advice that!

cheers mate