Co-dependant or in love?

[redneck]

How do you know if you really love someone?
There's a very good chance, (especially amongst drug takers) that you're just addicted to the co-dependency that exists between the two of you.

[ellie]

How do you know if you really love someone?
There's a very good chance, (especially amongst drug takers) that you're just addicted to the co-dependency that exists between the two of you.


i've been with my b/f for 4 years now - we arent heavy drug users so your second point doesnt really apply.

sometimes i worry that it is just co-dependency but the feelings i had for him when i first met him were overwhelming (better than any drug :love:) - and that was before we depended on each other for anything - and when i think about him now i still get those feelings.

TBH, i think as long as you are happy together and good for each other then putting too much thought into it will just drive you round the bend! :bounce_fl

[redneck]

I'm not really putting too much thought into it.
I've only just started understanding what it means to be honest and now I'm realising that most of my relationships have been co-dependant.
Not trying to have a go at you ellie but being with someone for 'X' amount of time doesn't make it a healthy relationship.
A lot of the older generation stay married for life but their marriages are a sham in my opinion as they only stay together out of social pressure.

[ellie]

I'm not really putting too much thought into it.
I've only just started understanding what it means to be honest and now I'm realising that most of my relationships have been co-dependant.
Not trying to have a go at you ellie but being with someone for 'X' amount of time doesn't make it a healthy relationship.
A lot of the older generation stay married for life but their marriages are a sham in my opinion as they only stay together out of social pressure.

hey i'm not saying it is a healthy relationship on the basis that we have been together for a long time... im saying it is a healthy relationship because i still get filled with excitement when i think about him and he makes me happy.

[rach]

theres nothing to say though that you cant be in love with someone and also addicted to the co-dependancy at the same time

i think you can delve forever into the philosophy of "how real are these feelings im feeling, and how can i trully tell if they're real or not?"... but why should you, life and human beings are never as basic and black and white as loving someone and not loving someone.

my parents may not be totally besotted with each other as they once were, but they care about each other so much and are happy with theyre lives.

if you feel like you want something more, then i believe always look for that something more - but theres no need to start questioning reality and happiness

[ellie]

theres nothing to say though that you cant be in love with someone and also addicted to the co-dependancy at the same time

i think you can delve forever into the philosophy of "how real are these feelings im feeling, and how can i trully tell if they're real or not?"... but why should you, life and human beings are never as basic and black and white as loving someone and not loving someone.



too true, too true

[redneck]

theres nothing to say though that you cant be in love with someone and also addicted to the co-dependancy at the same time

i think you can delve forever into the philosophy of "how real are these feelings im feeling, and how can i trully tell if they're real or not
it's a very complicated thing to know where one thing starts and the other one stops isn't it.
I believed i was in love for the last 6 months but after reading several books on the subject and talking to someone who attends regular co dependency meetings I'm beginning to see that a lot of what i thought was love is actually addiction to chaos and patterns of abandonment etc.

[Tank Girl]

it's a very complicated thing to know where one thing starts and the other one stops isn't it.
I believed i was in love for the last 6 months but after reading several books on the subject and talking to someone who attends regular co dependency meetings I'm beginning to see that a lot of what i thought was love is actually addiction to chaos and patterns of abandonment etc.
I think this one can be a toughy as it can be one person more than the other

looking back I think I was in a very co-dependant (drug using) relationship for about 6 yrs before Mr Tank,

I dont think it was particularily me,
but definatley him as he just needed to be with 'someone' (he'd been engaged 3 times before me - I refused when asked)
and after I finally left - despite threatening to kill me, himself etc
he immediatley got into another realtionship and they married - good luck to them as I believe they are happy



however saying that I remain happily dependant on Mr Tank for certain err.......... things :laugh_at:

[General Lighting]

I think with some young people and the middle aged couples what have houses/business at stake there is a lot of co-dependency, also often happens with couples who live together at a very early age because they are escaping "controlling" parents.

I don't think its the case for proper old people (OAP age, 60-100+)

by that time they are either genuinely in love or one partner is in HMP for murdering the other after an argument (not for the genuine sad cases of euthanasia as they usually get let free) thats what most sad old men are in HMP Norwich OAP wing for, I would stress though they are not all from Norfolk!

OTOH you often see these elderly couples getting their marriage vows renewed, one of them round here did it and they even found the original vicar from their church. They had to wheel the old man in up the ramp like Father Jack and their combined ages were around 250 but it was quite touching to see this going on

I don't think its because of "victorian values" or all that crap, but i think the friendships and relationships were stronger because people had to live through the wars, austerity etc so worked on their emotional ties a lot better..

[redneck]

(he'd been engaged 3 times before me - I refused when asked)

he immediatley got into another realtionship and they married - good luck to them as I believe they are happy

his name wasnt Ross by any chance? :laugh_at:

people who go from one relationship to the next without a break have definitely got issues and probably aren't really happy.
they've just found someone as messed up as them to share all their issues with.


I don't think its the case for proper old people (OAP age, 60-100+)

by that time they are either genuinely in love or one....

I don't think its because of "victorian values" or all that crap, but i think the friendships and relationships were stronger because people had to live through the wars, austerity etc so worked on their emotional ties a lot better..
Dont agree with that at all I'm afraid.
My mum and dad are nearly 70 and they have the most fucked up relationship I've ever come across and most of their friends seem to have similar problems.
People of that age tend to accept shit attitudes towards each other which have been passed down from years before.
Men shouldnt have to build a shed to escape their nagging wives and they shouldnt be in prison for killing their wives either.
All of that crap is about the same thing imo, ie, lack of communication.
That generation believe some fucked up shit and have never learned to look at their messed up belief systems.
You cant blame them though because they never had the information and knowledge that we have now.
Most of those older couples will tell you they're happy and in love but imo they've just learned to keep up a good front.
I dont believe a word of it personally.
Behind closed doors there's all kinds of mental, physical and emotional abuse going on.

[General Lighting]

Dont agree with that at all I'm afraid.
My mum and dad are nearly 70 and they have the most fucked up relationship I've ever come across and most of their friends seem to have similar problems.


sorry to hear that but in my area things are getting slightly better and you can't judge the whole society from just one or two couples. Also groups of friends tend to have similar views..

That generation believe some fucked up shit and have never learned to look at their messed up belief systems.
You cant blame them though because they never had the information and knowledge that we have now.
in the same way old people often learn how to use the net (how else do so many bumpkin parties get grassed up?) they can still change and have to change some of their belief systems to have the right to survive in todays society, especially when they demand expensive care from the public purse...



Most of those older couples will tell you they're happy and in love but imo they've just learned to keep up a good front.
I dont believe a word of it personally.
Behind closed doors there's all kinds of mental, physical and emotional abuse going on.true but this happens younger people as well and is far more prevalent there..

the harsh fact is that with the olds "big brother" works

old people end up having by necessity to involve carers, NHS, nursing homes in their lives because of health problems and dark secrets soon come out, simply because more and more people have access to information about their lives.

In this region people with authority and uniforms deal with it. Where I work if we hear of abuse it gets notified to the relevant authorities and action is taken (this is also why I have to keep my own nose clean as the cops are fairly often in contact with my office)

Its also why HMP Norwich is full of new intakes (not lifers who have been in for 30+ years).

But also a lot of older men still believe in authority, discipline and conventional power structures, especially if they were "something" in HM forces, Whitehall or the business "community".

This means that a simple visit from a bobby or social worker is often enough to shock them into behaving better at least for a few months, especially as prison or a secure mental health ward isn't a very nice place to be compared to a rural cottage.

mind you this area is going to be like that as some areas have 80% OAPs there..

and for all the bad stuff a lot of old men simply work in the shed because they are doing things in there involving metal, noise, oil etc what their wives would nag them even more for if they did it on the kitchen table! :laugh_at:

I know loads of old people because of work and they are no worse than younger couples I know.

Perhaps though what has happened though is all the progressive gains of the 1980s with regard to relationships/gender equality have been lost so despite the permissive society many youths today are no better than old people who grew up in the 1950s..

[Benzo]

after reading several books on the subject


not quite sure how that would help to know whether you are really in love. It's trials and tribulations that eventually prove whether there is anything really there, and that takes time. Once you're over the lusty/honeymoon/puppy love period and living with someone, you get to the grimy, dirty washing stage. If you can get through that and still even like the person and get on with them, there could be something there.


and after I finally left - despite threatening to kill me, himself etc



This is more like obsession or some sort of fear of abandonement. I havenever been able to put up with someone like that for long.

[Tank Girl]

Men shouldnt have to build a shed to escape their nagging wives

ha ha !!

Mr Tank has just built a shed :laugh_at:

some sort of fear of abandonement.

hit the nail right on the head,
he had been given up and adopted and had lots of unresolved issues about this,

he was on the whole a nice guy, and we got on as 'friends' - but everytime I tried to end it I couldnt .. which on reflection is one of the main reasons we were together for so long ...(my issues mixed in with his etc - all very boring)
until I did leave obviously!

[General Lighting]

ha ha !!

Mr Tank has just built a shed :laugh_at:



I'm single and I built a shed in 2006.

I just keep bicycles and gardening equipment / large items of tat what don't really belong in the house in it - I have a smaller house without a decent sized porch and light coloured carpet so can't keep the bikes inside because of mud and oil.

I think I may be the complete opposite to co-dependency - whilst I'm not a loner by any means (I like socialising) I am perfectly capable of existing without any large scale interaction with humans (other than what is needed for survival) for long amounts of time.

Its not something I'd want to do but can do so if I have to...

[redneck]

not quite sure how that would help to know whether you are really in love.
just for the record.
the books were about co-dependancy, not falling in love :wink:

[redneck]

sorry to hear that but in my area things are getting slightly better and you can't judge the whole society from just one or two couples. Also groups of friends tend to have similar views..

i think you're missing the point tbh.
not only on the above but on the whole subject.

[Tank Girl]

I'm single and I built a shed in 2006.

I just keep bicycles and gardening equipment / large items of tat what don't really belong in the house in it - I have a smaller house without a decent sized porch and light coloured carpet so can't keep the bikes inside because of mud and oil.

I think I may be the complete opposite to co-dependency - whilst I'm not loner by any means (I like socialising) I am perfectly capable of existing without any large scale interaction with humans (other than what is needed for survival) for long amounts of time.

Its not something I'd want to do but can do so if I have to...

(our shed now has our lambretta in it, :bounce_fl
we've also turned suburban and really got into gardening so all that stuff goes there too)

anyway back to the topic:

in my current relationship I love my independance and we have some simiilar but also lots of different interests and hobbies

(particularily partying - I love it he dont - so I tend to go off on my own for a few days and come back a wreck!!)

which I think is healthy - I am also happy not to see or speak to anyone for days on end, and have time to myself to reflect - but its all about balance as I also love socialising and rambelling to others about nonsense

[General Lighting]

i think you're missing the point tbh.
not only on the above but on the whole subject.

no, I'm just discussing the wider issues.

TBH I suspect much of the entire human race is co-dependent (especially with capitalist society) .

A lot of friendships associated with the rave scene are co-dependent.

and I suspect for other than very a small minority of people "love" doesn't really exist.

you don't know if you really love someone or they love you - but people make commitments to each other for as long as its "worth doing". Maybe in some cases its "caving into societys pressures" but as long as theres not serious abuse and its not causing a burden to others it doesn't bother me. Its as good as it ever gets - you either put up with the "good parts" or get out if its not worth doing.

[redneck]

just done a quick google to remind myself what I'm talking about here.
I do struggle with a few of the following myself as it goes;

Characteristics of Co-Dependent People Are:

" An exaggerated sense of responsibility for the actions of others.
" A tendency to confuse love and pity, with the tendency to "love" people they can pity and rescue.
" A tendency to do more than their share, all of the time.
" A tendency to become hurt when people don't recognize their efforts.
" An unhealthy dependence on relationships. The co-dependent will do anything to hold on to a relationship; to avoid the feeling of abandonment.
" An extreme need for approval and recognition.
" A sense of guilt when asserting themselves.
" A compelling need to control others.
" Lack of trust in self and/or others.
" Fear of being abandoned or alone.
" Difficulty identifying feelings.
" Rigidity/difficulty adjusting to change.
" Problems with intimacy/boundaries.
" Chronic anger.
" Lying/dishonesty.
" Poor communications
" Difficulty making decisions

[redneck]

TBH I suspect much of the entire human race is co-dependent (especially with capitalist society) .

and I suspect for other than very a small minority of people "love" doesn't really exist.

I agree :wink:

I wasnt having a dig.
just wasnt sure how to define what i was saying before.

[DJCliffy]

just done a quick google to remind myself what I'm talking about here.
I do struggle with a few of the following myself as it goes;

Characteristics of Co-Dependent People Are:

" An exaggerated sense of responsibility for the actions of others.
" A tendency to confuse love and pity, with the tendency to "love" people they can pity and rescue.
" A tendency to do more than their share, all of the time.
" A tendency to become hurt when people don't recognize their efforts.
" An unhealthy dependence on relationships. The co-dependent will do anything to hold on to a relationship; to avoid the feeling of abandonment.
" An extreme need for approval and recognition.
" A sense of guilt when asserting themselves.
" A compelling need to control others.
" Lack of trust in self and/or others.
" Fear of being abandoned or alone.
" Difficulty identifying feelings.
" Rigidity/difficulty adjusting to change.
" Problems with intimacy/boundaries.
" Chronic anger.
" Lying/dishonesty.
" Poor communications
" Difficulty making decisions


OH NO! I have chronic anger but hardly any of the others. I feel like such a freak.

[redneck]

OH NO! I have chronic anger but hardly any of the others. I feel like such a freak.
try harder

[DJCliffy]

try harder

With pleasure! :laugh_at:

[lilmstrixta]

I understand what you mean my ex boyfriend i think i had a co dependancy relationship with in the end i just resented him and it made me feel sick when he touched me, i do however think that my current partner who i do live with i do love thats not a co dependant thing.

[Tank Girl]

just done a quick google to remind myself what I'm talking about here.
I do struggle with a few of the following myself as it goes;

Characteristics of Co-Dependent People Are:

" An exaggerated sense of responsibility for the actions of others.
" A tendency to confuse love and pity, with the tendency to "love" people they can pity and rescue.
" A tendency to do more than their share, all of the time.
" A tendency to become hurt when people don't recognize their efforts.
" An unhealthy dependence on relationships. The co-dependent will do anything to hold on to a relationship; to avoid the feeling of abandonment.
" An extreme need for approval and recognition.
" A sense of guilt when asserting themselves.
" A compelling need to control others.
" Lack of trust in self and/or others.
" Fear of being abandoned or alone.
" Difficulty identifying feelings.
" Rigidity/difficulty adjusting to change.
" Problems with intimacy/boundaries.
" Chronic anger.
" Lying/dishonesty.
" Poor communications
" Difficulty making decisions

OPPS - I take it all back - thats me to a T :laugh_at:

wheres my nearest co-dep meeting????

[pixiegirl]

just done a quick google to remind myself what I'm talking about here.
I do struggle with a few of the following myself as it goes;

Characteristics of Co-Dependent People Are:

" An exaggerated sense of responsibility for the actions of others.
" A tendency to confuse love and pity, with the tendency to "love" people they can pity and rescue.
" A tendency to do more than their share, all of the time.
" A tendency to become hurt when people don't recognize their efforts.
" An unhealthy dependence on relationships. The co-dependent will do anything to hold on to a relationship; to avoid the feeling of abandonment.
" An extreme need for approval and recognition.
" A sense of guilt when asserting themselves.
" A compelling need to control others.
" Lack of trust in self and/or others.
" Fear of being abandoned or alone.
" Difficulty identifying feelings.
" Rigidity/difficulty adjusting to change.
" Problems with intimacy/boundaries.
" Chronic anger.
" Lying/dishonesty.
" Poor communications
" Difficulty making decisions

I do tend to do more than my share, all the time. Although I'm pretty sure that is just my personality other than that I can happily say that I can't tick anymore of those boxes.

My husband and I have a very close relationship, it has been that way since the day we met. It wouldn't suit everyone I'm sure but we're blissful so that is what counts imo.