Police Car SMASHED at Rave

[Digital-A]

Originally posted by boothy

its a shame specially for people my age... what are they gonna experience at their first free party? probably not the great atmosphere of an early 90's party.

having said that i have hope for the future... i have faith in my upcoming generation and reckon we won't be as reckless and pathetic... there is a big backlash against the "chav" culture of destruction, some backlash is good (thinking of real solutions, bringing back a more PLUR approach) but some is bad (clampdown, support on less civil rights etc.)

still, better to be optimistic than pessimistic!

yeah damn right you'll enjoy it

the atmosphere is still immense, dont get me wrong the party scene has changed including attitudes within the scene and out of it but it is still my weekend escape ...

and i hope it is better for your the next few generations, yet for some reason i cant see it being.

[tarifa]

Originally posted by Tank Girl

Its just such a shame - what ever happened to
Peace
Love
Unity
Respect?
Or am I just an old hippie romantacising the good ' old ' days?
It just gives even more of an argument that the coppers / media / etc can use against the already damaged scene

PLUR exactly. An I agree with you that there are decent coppers (don't everyone blow up, there are a few out there)

But I reckon you do have the rose-tinted specs on a bit. There have always been periodic violent confrontations since the begining.

Clashes in the late 80s early 90s were common. When I was starting out the free festival clampdown was in full swing.

And i now sit here and talk about how violence isn't the answer and just makes things worse, but I can't really throw stones

Nowadays I'm all calm and philosophical and stuff but back then I was an angry young nightmare, I was involved in all sorts. Took a young lad getting killed at a hunt sab, and the ensuing riot, to wake me up to what I was actually involved in.

Yes people shouldn't trash police cars at parties but you've got anger and resentment and alcohol and other mind-bending chemicals all mixed together in one big pot!

So it shouldn't come as too big a surprise that these things happen. I dont think any of us can stand on too high a horse! an one car is not going to kill the scene

[Mariju]

i was there, n saw it all...

i was trippin hard thou so it took a few hours for me to be persuaded it was actually a smashed up po car...

fuckin stupid what happend to it thou, they didnt shut it down thou, far too many people there.

couldnt actually believe it, ah well sort them mothers out!

[General Lighting]

Tarifa is right, all these things were happening back in the 1980s and 1990s.

If anything attitudes have improved on both sides, that could have been a lot worse, there were at least 14 police units on site (ranging from traffic cars to a dog van and some serials ("riot vans"). The cops were initially all set to stop the rave and some tense stand-offs occured earlier that night, and rumours that dogs were set on people at a meeting point.

At least no one on either side got hurt, although most of the people >18 years or their families who live round here will end up paying for the car in the end through their Council Tax.

The sad part of it is its only a very small minority who attend raves who do this sort of thing and I suspect they are responsible for the vandalism of vehicles other than police cars at raves.

Later in the night, some girls gathered up the scattered items from the police car and put them in a box for the cops to recover, and someone put a tarpaulin over the vehicle to try and deter people for wrecking it any futher.

A small gesture made in hindsight, but a lot of people present did not agree with the trashing of the cop car and it did change the atmosphere of the party a bit (lots of people genuinely felt a bit ashamed by it, plus they were worried about reprisals from the police.)

The cops who attended later in the morning actually seemed to accept that the bulk of people at the party were not involved with this incident, which appears to be being treated as a separate crime to the rave itself..

People do need to choose their friends a bit better though, otherwise the scum is going to give everyone a bad name.

[Bitch Tit]

god this really pisses me off that people who put on these parties and the people who go to them do not have manners and the decency to behave.

police officers do have a job to do, and they are from a side of life that will never completely understand.

I have been to parties and danced with a copper to barry white and there were over 100 partiers there. why not have a f*cking demonstration or something. there are loads of kids at parties these days and we have to keep an eye out for them, and this is not a good example.

we are all responsible so to all those idiots who want to 'f*ck the system', think of others and get a grip of your anger and what ever you are putting in to your body to make you act like children on blue smarties.

there all done now.

[Shit Robot]

Originally posted by General Lighting

a lot of people present did not agree with the trashing of the cop car

Have just watched a video of the incident and there is a girl actively trying to dissuade any further damage.Good on her IMO, just a shame that some people didn't pay any attention.

Maybe with women sensible comes as standard lol

[tarifa]

Originally posted by GoodDoG

Maybe with women sensible comes as standard lol

[globalloon]

pricks like this shouldn't be allowed at parties. the fact that more people didn't try and stop them is pathetic

[funkydan]

Originally posted by globalloon

pricks like this shouldn't be allowed at parties. the fact that more people didn't try and stop them is pathetic

yup tis true. someone almost got bottled aswell

but have to say most people are nice and dont do shit like tht and need to realise violence doesnt solve anything but more trouble

[General Lighting]

Originally posted by funkydan

yup tis true. someone almost got bottled aswell

WTF? was that for challenging the person smashing the car, or a separate incident?

EA party people have to sort this out very quickly, otherwise your local scene will be fucked like everywhere else in this country. Worst of all, all the haters and fighters will have won as they can still fight and smash up stuff in town, whilst the positive party crews find it impossible to do events..

OTOH I doubt if many of the people who do such things at parties use the internet or forums, so its maybe a matter of people at "street level" just stopping giving these people directions or lifts - leave them in town to play the idiot there..

[Digital-A]

Was speaking to me brother in one of the northern crews, theyve heared about it and are worried for the southern crews ... the north hasnt got all this rave shutdown crap going on you see ...

[lemonzorba]

well, some parties in the north do get shut down and there is trouble at parties from morons too, but from experience of living in manchester these are the ones that are in the city centre (but all of these parties obviously), rather than ones out in the sticks.

[Raj]

why are these kind of people still finding out about parties - they will ruin them for everyone.....better to have 30 people at a party with a good vibe than 100 people and one of these guys at it.

[globalloon]

Originally posted by Raj

why are these kind of people still finding out about parties - they will ruin them for everyone.....better to have 30 people at a party with a good vibe than 100 people and one of these guys at it.

i'm feeling a bit like BioTech

better to just not have a party at all if this is the best people can manage

[Raj]

I can see why you would feel like that

[m45k1]

Just to add to GL,

As soon as this happened and people were made aware 99% were outraged! and the rig were trying to discover who was involved to sort it out. This is not an acceptable or encouraged act at parties round this way. If a group of chavs do manage to get to a party, people cannot constantly monitor everyones behaviour. The community relies on people having respect and abiding by unwritten rules, its everyones job to make these values known to new commers.

Also the place was left absolutely mint, although it wasn't admitted in the paper the police PRAISED the effort of us all several times. Don't believe everything you read!

[globalloon]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/suffolk/6654363.stm

the beebeecee gave a balanced report

[General Lighting]

more here from Archant (local news organisation for East anglia which run a lot of different papers but often put the same article in each one!)

http://www.eadt.co.uk/content/eadt/n...A05%3A44%3A173

Unfortunately the NFU are now whinging yet again

http://www.eadt.co.uk/content/eadt/n...A50%3A54%3A070

[General Lighting]

Originally posted by GoodDoG

Have just watched a video of the incident and there is a girl actively trying to dissuade any further damage.Good on her IMO, just a shame that some people didn't pay any attention.

Maybe with women sensible comes as standard lol

I think it does, and unfortunately for us it seems to be getting to the point where a lot of girls/women abandon the party scene in their mid 20s after University or getting their first "proper" job / becoming a parent as they feel its no longer worth defending.

A lot of the girls I know from "back in the day" have gone this way and they are not social conservatives or "squares" but intelligent and open minded people.

Also a lot of idealistic young teenage girls end up being treated quite badly by their blokes - there is sadly a fair bit of misogyny on the party scene today so when these girls mature they realise how they have been used and there is a backlash. (it did seem a bit better in this respect back in the 90s as there was still the remnants of the 80s "equal opportunities" mindset)

This creates a vicious circle whereby raves become more male-dominated and angrier and the violence increases..

[kelz_side]

Originally posted by Meltown

fellow party goers sent me a picture message eariler, smashed to bits

its all over squatjuice 2, lots more cussing for the bumpkins

Thats unfair to say that! it isnt all of norfolk, just a handful of people, yer the person/people who trashed that car are complete idiots, but surely the blame cant be put on all norfolk ravers!

[tarifa]

Hey GL,

I get that you're saying things have changed but i just have to say that as a person of the female persuasion who grew up in the party scene i never felt it was misogynistic, numerically male dominated perhaps (not a problem ) but not women-hating.

I think it was less so than 'normal' society. Male or female made absolutely no difference to what you could do/be/say/think/take.

I was based mostly in South West UK, was it different in other areas?

Question for the girls - am I alone in this positive experience? Do you think the party scene is misogynistic? What do the boys think?

[General Lighting]

Originally posted by tarifa

Hey GL,

I get that you're saying things have changed but i just have to say that as a person of the female persuasion who grew up in the party scene i never felt it was misogynistic, numerically male dominated perhaps (not a problem ) but not women-hating.

I think it was less so than 'normal' society. Male or female made absolutely no difference to what you could do/be/say/think/take.

I'd agree that was definitely the case in the early to mid 1990s, when raves were genuinely more of an alternative society.

By the late 1990s the "macho/lad culture" from "townie" groups was starting to creep into groups of people who were part of the rave scene. Its all linked in with the same mindset of angry young men who think its OK to fight and smash up cars at raves.

[General Lighting]

Originally posted by kelz_side

Thats unfair to say that! it isnt all of norfolk, just a handful of people, yer the person/people who trashed that car are complete idiots, but surely the blame cant be put on all norfolk ravers!

it happens everywhere in the country - whenever a police car is left unattended... and not just at raves. When radio scanners used to work my mates would hear of such incidents fairly often.

most of the time it is a small minority of people with existing beef against the Police, often simply because they have done real crime like thieving from houses or shops or robbing cars and the cops have caught them and punished them for it.

The scum who do this often have nothing to do with parties or rigs but just seem to tag along to parties because their "friends" look up to them because they are "hard", or I suspect maybe some can give people lifts in the cars they have nicked.

the reason IMO there is so much anger against East Anglian ravers is simply because some other areas of the country have already fucked up their local scenes due to overuse of venues and other stupidity - they can't do raves any more and the smarter crews from that way have already given up.

so they are just jealous that parties still happen in this area..

[tarifa]

Originally posted by General Lighting

I'd agree that was definitely the case in the early to mid 1990s, when raves were genuinely more of an alternative society.

By the late 1990s the "macho/lad culture" from "townie" groups was starting to creep into groups of people who were part of the rave scene. Its all linked in with the same mindset of angry young men who think its OK to fight and smash up cars at raves.

Ok so what you're saying is that rave has evolved from underground alternative and been invaded by mainstream beer-swilling 'lad' culture yes?

Fine, but I still maintain that the violence was always there even if the misogyny is a recent development. It was angry and violent in the 80s!

I'd be interested to see if the incidence of vandalism and violent acts e.g. pig cars getting trashed etc has grown or arseholes just turning up, holding everyone up and stealing the system ha sincreased (statistically adjusted for the increase in general party activity) - if that makes sense?

Scuse my less than usual succintness, am v tired an outside a few well earne drinks

[General Lighting]

Originally posted by tarifa

Ok so what you're saying is that rave has evolved from underground alternative and been invaded by mainstream beer-swilling 'lad' culture yes?

yes, indeed, and even after it was doing the opposite in the early 90s - the breweries fought back, fought hard and regained control over the nightlife..

Fine, but I still maintain that the violence was always there even if the misogyny is a recent development. It was angry and violent in the 80s!

I'd agree with that for the mid to late 80s (both at "street level" and the "alternative scene") but things in my area (SE England/London/East Anglia) and my peer groups definitely did change for the better from about 1990 to 1992.

Me and my mates found that the rave scene and music did give us at least a few hours/days of positive thinking each week; yes we did some dodgy or criminal things and there was a bit of a blagging culture (shoplifting, petty theft etc) but there was also principles - we never robbed dwelling houses or used violence and a fight amongst our group was extremely rare (about one every year if that)

We didn't like rules or authority and certainly weren't fond of the Police, but when partying there was some "unwritten set of rules". Not quite the sickly-sweet American-inspired "PLUR" type things but a sort of modernised version of "gentlemanly conduct/chivalry"....

This euphoria didn't last that long (by 1993 things were returning to "normal") but it was there and remains a turning point in my life.

I'd be interested to see if the incidence of vandalism and violent acts e.g. pig cars getting trashed etc has grown or arseholes just turning up, holding everyone up and stealing the system ha sincreased (statistically adjusted for the increase in general party activity) - if that makes sense?

I have only known of a handful of rigs to be robbed with violence (mostly in inner cities although I think it once happened in Devon) since the scene started - this is a very isolated risk indeed and most of the people who did such things were the sort of gangsters who now tend to prey on the commercial UK garage scene (or are thankfully either dead or in prison).

In inner cities such as London or Bristol robberies and thefts are still a problem, although many are due to k-heads being easy targets for opportunists.

I don't think there actually is enough money or bling to attract serious gangsters to small raves held in remote areas, otherwise one would have already have been properly shot up or firebombed by now. TBH the large bulk of the people who attend unlicensed raves aren't anything like that at all.

What has definitely increased in the last 6-7 years is the sort of problem a "pissed up townie lad" would cause at a rave - pointless scuffles over girls, domestic arguments in public, people using raves to settle old scores.

I wonder if its also because town venues are getting more robust at banning and ejecting idiots, who somehow end up finding free parties.

I still think it can be combatted by people being a bit more careful about their circles of friends; people don't randomly drive about the countryside looking for raves, someone has to have told them the area where the party is.

I know it sounds harsh/élitist but I have had to do this before with people I know who get too drunk and see the "freedom" of a party as a freedom to act like an idiot.. (and some have actually understood why I did it and respected me for doing so)